<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">We tend to ask permission for such things <div>No permission - we don't include and much of the time - don't use them period. </div><div><br></div><div>If you have ever seen the movie "Be Kind Rewind" - you can make a funny parallel </div><div>Big Business won't care about the little guy (even if we are a church) and will work to go after their "intellectual property."</div><div><br></div><div>Hope that helps </div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div>On Mar 13, 2009, at 9:05 AM, LeVeque, Josh wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div class="Section1"><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">I should probably clarify that I am not talking about software. Software licensing tends to be pretty cut and dry as well as controllable. What I am talking about ar</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">e</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">videos/multimedia both in worship services and online, redistribution through YouTube or hosted directly on the church site. For instance, on our podcast/sermon audio, we don’t include our worship set for download or streaming. We also cut out things which fall under “fair use” in a teaching environment, but could possibly not be seen the same way if they were redistributed online.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">I know I’ve seen a blog post from Tim Stephens<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.leadingsmart.com/leadingsmart/2007/04/copyright_or_co.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">here</a>. I was just wondering where others stand.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Josh</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div><div style="border-right-style: none; border-bottom-style: none; border-left-style: none; border-width: initial; border-color: initial; border-top-style: solid; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding-top: 3pt; padding-right: 0in; padding-bottom: 0in; padding-left: 0in; "><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; ">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org">discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org</a> [<a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Bobby Stewart<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday, March 12, 2009 5:23 PM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>IT Discussion Forum<br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [itdiscuss] Copyright<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">I agree. I have had occasion to have to decide on a software product. Part of the decision was that someone in the organization had distributed improperly licensed versions of that product to users. I decided that it was best for me to purchase the product I otherwise might not have, in order to compensate the publisher for the product that was effectively stolen.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">It may be a “render unto Caesar” (Mat 22:21) but it is also a “worker deserves his wages” (1 Tim 5:18b) issue. We may not like the amounts that are charged but we would be thieves if we used the software without paying for the license to do so.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">So, if we take the “liberal” position as you’ve stated it (ask forgiveness rather than permission) we also run afoul of, “Are we to remain in sin so that grace may increase?” (Rom 6:1). Rather we should “abstain from all appearance of evil” (1 Thes 5:22), letting “[our] yes be yes and [our] no be no so that [we] may not fall into judgment” (Mat 5:37) and we should “let [our] light so shine before men that they may see [our] good works and glorify [our] Father in Heaven.”<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">In its own way, careless use of software, images and text for web pages, bulletins, postcards, video presentations or anything else we may do in the church for which we’ve not been granted the proper permissions is a stain on the Church and soils the name of Jesus.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">OK, that was a little preachy but sometimes it just comes out. To sum it up, I vote conservative.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Blessings,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Bobby Stewart<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Network Analyst<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Brentwood Baptist Church<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Brentwood, TN<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">(615) 324-6149 office<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">(615) 830-0012 cell<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div><div style="border-right-style: none; border-bottom-style: none; border-left-style: none; border-width: initial; border-color: initial; border-top-style: solid; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding-top: 3pt; padding-right: 0in; padding-bottom: 0in; padding-left: 0in; "><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; ">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org">discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org</a> [<a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Thompson, Ken<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday, March 12, 2009 4:02 PM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>IT Discussion Forum<br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [itdiscuss] Copyright<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">MTW strives to keep both the letter and the spirit of the law. If we find we have messed up we work to make it right. We prefer to ask permission rather than to ask forgiveness and find that most people are more than happy to give that permission.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Ken Thompson<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">IT Manager, Mission to the World<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div><div style="border-right-style: none; border-bottom-style: none; border-left-style: none; border-width: initial; border-color: initial; border-top-style: solid; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding-top: 3pt; padding-right: 0in; padding-bottom: 0in; padding-left: 0in; "><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; ">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org">discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org</a> [<a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">mailto:discuss-bounces@itdiscuss.org</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>LeVeque, Josh<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday, March 12, 2009 4:19 PM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>IT Discussion Forum<br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[itdiscuss] Copyright<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Just wanted to get some opinions, how are you guys handling copyright?<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Would you consider your approach to be conservative (you are NOT doing things you’d like to do because of copyright), neutral (you dance in the grey areas) or liberal (you ask for forgiveness rather than ask for permission)? I was looking specifically when it comes to what you distribute to the web or have on your servers. What are your common practices?<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">I know it’s not a topic that lots of people want to address, but I really am interested in the logic and processes you are using with regards to copyright.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Josh<o:p></o:p></div></div>_______________________________________________<br>it discuss mailing list:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:discuss@itdiscuss.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">discuss@itdiscuss.org</a><br>Mailing List:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://itdiscuss.org/discuss" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">http://itdiscuss.org/discuss</a><br>Web Discussion Board:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://itdiscuss.org/discuss-forum" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">http://itdiscuss.org/discuss-forum</a><br>Wiki:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://itdiscuss.org/wiki" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">http://itdiscuss.org/wiki</a><br>Internet Relay Chat:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="irc://irc.freenode.net/citrt" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">irc://irc.freenode.net/citrt</a><br></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>